It should be criminal that so many laptops they sold the past few years have 8gb of ram.
All of those people will be looking to upgrade within a year, which is the plan…
Apple just can’t resist making ridiculous margins from their customers, even when their devices do allow for upgrades to the default configuration.
For instance, with a Mac Pro, you have to pay an extra $800 to go from 64gb to 128gb of memory. For $800, you could get about 384gb of ram in 64gb sticks from a different vendor.
Dude, “640k is enough for anyone.”
I know it’s an unpopular opinion in these parts, but honestly, 8gb is often fine for the people who are buying entry level machines.
I use a 2014 Mac mini for work, which has 8gb of soldered RAM. For sure I’d increase it to 16gb if I could, but I honestly can’t say I have any issues with it. It’s running Sonoma via OCLP like a champ.
But yeah, what Apple charge for RAM is downright criminal.
What’s the different between you shilling ram today and them shilling upgrades tomorrow ?
Does someone tie your shoes for you or are they Velcro?
The software of today is more demanding than the hardware. You have to increase the hardware to have a good user experience.
The upgrades that they are shilling are neither hardware nor software upgrades. They are just an addition of Learning Language Models (LLMs) that only give information based on statistical data and sentence structures. This is why many of the AI chat bots out there are extremely unreliable.
The integration of Ai into user devices is, simply, a waste of user storage, hardware, processing power, and bogs down a system that is already running at capacity due to the hardware limitations (not increasing the standard RAM amount).
8gb of ram is definitely not ideal for the computer lifetimes people expect from macs, even for a very basic user, but it’s not too low to be forgivable except for the fact that modern macs use a SOC design and can’t upgrade the “RAM” (I know it’s not conventional ram; still gonna call it that). That aside, assuming “they” is still apple, the majority of what you said is… not correct. I’m gonna try to reply to each point without being a dick, but I’m sorry in advance in case it comes off that way or if it goes way too long. In order:
The average Mac owner’s use cases are nowhere near too demanding for the hardware - ever since they stopped trying to cram inefficient intel cores into a tiny chassis with the world’s shittiest cooling (2020), macs have been significantly more powerful than the average user needs in the short term. Someone who’s only trying to run some safari/firefox tabs, iMessage, a music client, and maybe a document or spreadsheet editor at most isn’t gonna be held back by the hardware of today at all - shit, 2020’s original base M1 macbook air with no fans would still be chugging along just fine today with that workload. On the off time a user like that does max out their ram (chrome with a million tabs, or if they’ve got a lot open and try the new apple intelligence stuff) modern ssds are fast enough that bumping a program into swap space doesn’t make the UI take a year like on HDDs. Should there still be more than 8gb ram on a computer (theoretically) designed to last 8+ years? Ideally, yes, but it’s really not the dealbreaker (again, for the average use case) that people make it out to be - it’s not gonna suddenly turn a new mac into a steaming pile of shit on year 3 or something.
About upgrades, I’m not really sure how to address this - what upgrades are just adding LLMs? Whether you’re talking computers or phones, I can’t remember an upgrade cycle for either in ages that hasn’t been double digit power increases. Software-wise, none of the upcoming software updates are “just” AI stuff - ios 18 adds a bunch of cool shit and while I don’t follow or care about Mac software, I’m sure a lot of that made its way over there too. This part is a little pedantic (please don’t take it as me being an asshole lol, zero hostility I promise), but I also wanna note it’s not just LLMs - they’ve got multimodal models for images and video too.
Your last point is subjective so I won’t try to claim your opinion (other than the bit about modern hardware running at capacity) is wrong. I do wanna offer a counterpoint tho, because while I agree that AI is overhyped and a lot of what companies are bragging about is mostly fluff (fucking genmoji???), there’s some tangible ways it’s gonna improve user experience. A more flexible Siri is probably gonna be the most-used one, since needing to be perfectly explicit and clear about what you want Siri to do is probably its biggest problem rn. An LLM backend will let it look past a badly phrased request or a stutter to the actual meaning of what you were trying to say, which is gonna make telling someone you’re about to get there while driving so much less painful.
The one I’m personally most excited about is one of the multimodal AI capabilities - fuck the image generation/editing (fun but overhyped imo), semantic media searches (searching photos for “mom and dad in front of that one waterfall”) are such a game changer, and the idea that I can have that without sending my photos and contacts to some external server is so wild to me.Anyway, not trying to argue that 8gb of ram is a good design choice or force you to like AI, but I’m pretty into cpu/gpu/SOC advances and couldn’t just let them be slandered
Given most of the “upgrades” are AI bullshit I’ll gladly keep my POS phone, thanks
Last year’s ‘upgrade’ was a strip of titanium around the case. They seem to be running out of ideas. Definitely not worth the insane price tag.
They start to lock out old phones from new updates. We gave my grandma an old phone (an 8) but it only supports io16 so we can’t enable ‘senior mode’. Barely 7 year old device.
Barely 7 year old device
I mean yes, but also Android manufacturers are only NOW starting to catch up to Apple. Used to be you’d buy a flagship Android device and get 2 or 3 years. My Oneplus 7 Pro from 2019 (5 year old model) hasn’t gotten a new major Android version since 12 which came out 3 years ago. That was my last Android phone (for now - I might go back eventually) and now with iPhones, I’ll just give it to my mom when I get bored with it because she doesn’t have a huge budget and the phone will keep getting updates for years.
When it comes to iPhones, Apple has never been about planned obsolescence, or at least hasn’t been as bad as Android manufacturers. It’s the stupid ass users who judge people based on having older models. Luckily those types are a minority of Apple users, they’re just loud.
I think apple is doing some planned obsolescence with their software. I’m not sure exactly when, but I’ve been stuck on my current iOS version for more than a year. So 5-6 years of support? It’s not very long for a trillion dollar company to support one of their main product lines.
The bottom line for me is that I just don’t care about this area of tech. It anti-interesting to me. Handheld computer that can make calls, we’ve had them for 20 years now. Very cool, mostly unchanged. The screen is better. They still break when you drop them. There are a lot of apps now.
They started that a looong time ago.
That’s what I mean - start, not started. It’s annoying. Should be 10 year support unless the phone actually can’t do things.
How else are you suppose to identify the poors?
Lol. Still trucking along on my iPhone X.
Same actually, and a refurb m1. That’s not to say apple doesn’t use predatory tactics, and hard agree with complaining about laptops sold with 8gb of ram. I use windows, Mac, and Linux daily, and for my devices I want to last and not worry about, I go apple.
While OSX is very memory efficient, it’s insane that my 2011 MacBook Pro has 16GB of RAM and you can buy a laptop with half of that 13 years later.
No it isnt
shoo
+1 for the M1, went for a refurb on a whim and it was the first time in a while I genuinely felt like I was living in the future. That thing can run Stray at more than competent frame rates and still be dead silent and lukewarm to the touch. It’s like a big Steam Deck
They made a Twitter version iPhone?!
XS Max here, it’s insane how long these things last. I will be upgrading this year though, cuz my partner has a 64GB phone and needs way more space for cat pictures. I’d like 120hz and USB-C!
It’s a 900 dollar device
cool
Very perceptive.
Most high-end phones are 900-1000$ nowadays anyway, so it really doesn’t matter much. It’s more of if you want Android or Ios.
Yeah I think the point i made badly, was that the new norm seems to be, if you get 5 years out of a $1000 device you think it’s good value .
I do agree that, getting 5 years out of a $1000 phone is stupid. But at the same time it’s the best we can do right now. Massive companies like Apple or Samsung are not gonna listen to us that much.
XR for me.
Honestly the biggest issue that was pushing me to update was that my podcatcher had been getting laggier and slower to respond to remote commands when minimized. I thought it was a ram constraint, but the developer refactored the 10 year old code base last month and now it’s zippy as heck.
Now, my only issues are ones expected of any phone of its age: battery wear (repairable), RAM limiting minimized persistence of modern apps (no compelling leap until maybe this year) and storage space (manageable). I am looking forward to MagSafe, USB-C, Oled and left behind support for AirPods whenever I eventually do upgrade.
I had a XR until 18 months ago, and honestly, it was still a solid device. But part of the good thing about using an iPhone is how well they hold their value, so I made the choice to sell it while it was still worth £150. Put that towards a 13 mini which will serve me nicely for a couple more years yet.
“Such is the scale of advancements we’ve made, that 2024 Tim Cook would walk up to 2023 Tim Cook holding a bit ‘L’ on his forehead before giving him an atomic wedgie for having such a crappy iphone.
I like the joke but this is so clumsily written.
Agreed! Might be better phrased as,
"We’ve made so many advancements that 2023 Tim Cook would look at 2024 Tim Cook utterly horrified at his own ineptitude, and look at a mirror while holding up a big L on his forehead before giving himself an atomic wedgie.
I’m not a fan of the whole “atomic wedgie” bit either, feels dated
As an Android user, I completely agree with this statement but probably for different reasons.
Crapple heads will buy anything their programmers tell them to.
“but ive gotta keep buying their products because I’m already in the ecosystem…so it’s just easier at this point” -The common cope
“I’ll downvote people who point out my behavior”\ - The common cope
See you say this, but anyone who bought a cheapo Galaxy S20 in 2020, stopped receiving major Android version updates in 2022 whereas anyone who bought an iPhone XS or XR in 2018, will still get a major iOS version update in 2024…
Oh wait, what’s this, the S20 was a flagship device, comparable or more expensive than the iPhone 12 at the time? Well that’s a bit embarrassing…
👍
“I don’t like things that are different”
