• Varyk@sh.itjust.works
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    4 months ago

    This is the real next step, every other battery hasn’t made it to production, but if they’re sending out working EV batteries to EV manufacturers and have production line running then it’s finally real.

    And as soon as Korea starts mass producing long range, quick charge solid state batteries, the factories in China are going to start mass-producing them as well.

    Regardless of what it means politically, this is fantastic news, I didn’t know they were actually producing them beyond prototype stage into commercial production.

    Heellll yeah.

          • hubobes@sh.itjust.works
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            4 months ago

            I mean it is just economic warfare. China substitutes their EV producers to undercut competing countries. They respond with tarrifs. That is business as usual since global trade exists.

              • catloaf@lemm.ee
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                4 months ago

                The tariffs are to compensate for the Chinese government subsidizing production.

                • sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works
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                  4 months ago

                  Are they? Or is it protectionism?

                  I’d like to see some actual numbers here, because 100% tariffs seems to be more than just the subsidies, but also includes labor cost disparity.

              • jumjummy@lemmy.world
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                4 months ago

                Completely free trade works as well as unregulated capitalism in that it’s terrible for the consumers. You’ll always end up with a monopoly.

                • sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works
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                  4 months ago

                  I don’t think that’s true. There are other mechanisms besides tariffs and direct regulations that can help regulate markets, depending on what you’re looking for. For example:

                  • carbon taxes - charge companies for the cost of removing the carbon they emit; this would look like a tariff for imported goods, but they can reduce the tax by proving the carbon they emit is lower
                  • anti-trust - break up companies that break the law
                  • remove certain corporate protections - jail execs, increase liability (e.g. protect retirement assets and primary house, but not investments), etc
                  • more consistent and active enforcement of the laws we do have

                  I’m not saying we should flip the switch overnight to free trade, I’m saying we should be moving that direction. The only case I can see for tariffs is to reverse government subsidies. If we can prove China subsidizes EVs by X%, I’m fine with a matching tariff to level the playing field. However, if they’re merely able to produce them cheaper because labor there is cheaper, a tariff is merely protectionism and therefore illegitimate, and we should instead compete with automation or quality.

                  • hubobes@sh.itjust.works
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                    4 months ago

                    That is all theoretically possible inside your country or trade union but not if countries wage economic war against each other. China will not break up BYD once they have gotten rid of their competition. They want the biggest car manufacturer. So they will try to reach that goal no matter what.

      • Varyk@sh.itjust.works
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        4 months ago

        Won’t matter much; Chinese EVs are so inexpensively made, especially with subsidies, while exceeding European and American auto safety standards that tariffs for the last five years haven’t stopped them expanding outside of Asia.

        In addition, EVs are so much cheaper to produce, run and maintain for auto companies that tariffs aren’t going to make much of a difference stemming the continued EV manufacturing explosion.

        Capacity and range will just keep going up, any tariffs have so far been and will be footnotes in EV story rather than any sort of relevant market mechanism

        • Freefall@lemmy.world
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          4 months ago

          Chinese EV sounds terrifying. I am sure the specific cars they sent for safety testing were well made and passed just fine, but I wouldn’t get into their production run vehicles.

          • Varyk@sh.itjust.works
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            4 months ago

            Nah, these are the exact standards US/euro cars are tested by, tested annually from regular production, not specially chosen cars.

            Besides, it isn’t like American or European companies didn’t make production line cars that literally blew up if they rear-ended someone.

            So far the manufacturing of exported Chinese EVs is doing very well, and each product is tested upon import anyway to make sure it conforms to the regulations of that country.

            Tanking a potential market like this for the Chinese doesn’t make any sense right now, at least outside of their country it makes the most corporate and political sense to do what they’re doing and exceed European and American auto safety standards.

            You should be more concerned about privacy invasion from the smart tech rather than the physical safety of the vehicles.

          • Krauerking@lemy.lol
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            4 months ago

            Who do you think manufactures basically everything at this point? Even frickin food is being imported from China.

            That being said I’d love for American competition, heck I’d just like the Elio I always wanted if it wasn’t for fricking Hummer. And Teslas have been built like garbage for the past couple years now.

            It being manufactured in China does not make it a quality issue unless the profit seeking is maxed out. Otherwise it just makes it like everything else being made over there which is it’s own problem.

        • Diplomjodler@lemmy.world
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          4 months ago

          My point is the the EU ans US are shooting themselves in the foot in a big way with these idiotic tariffs. The Chinese will just clean up in all other markets and if they retaliate, the EU will lose their most important export market, which is China.

          • Varyk@sh.itjust.works
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            4 months ago

            I think the US is hoping to buy itself some time while their EV manufacturing catches up, but they aren’t being practical about the limited effect of these tariffs and aren’t making the necessary domestic investments so far to compete with the level of manufacture the Chinese are at and the level the Japanese and a few other countries will be at in 5 years.

            The market is still going to end up with safe, affordable EVs sooner than anyone thought, so I can’t get too worked up about the US not jumping into the race.

            If they don’t want to catch up, then they get left behind.

            They let others manufacture their TVs, computers, and toilet paper, it’s not unlikely they’ll let their national auto industry die as well.