- cross-posted to:
- world@lemmy.world
- cross-posted to:
- world@lemmy.world
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I’m all for Europe doing their own thing. I’m an American and even I hate seeing the US use it’s position for bully politics. No citizen of any other country should ever thing that an American company or govt will treat them with dignity or respect. Look at how we treat each other.
Why do Visa and MasterCard exist? The middleman that jacks up the price while offering the end user nothing? Thanks capitalism.
There was a time back in the day it was useful.
Before smartphones, credit cards were the cashless option.
Now that we all have a more than capable payment terminal in our pocket, Visa and mastercard are obsolete
Sorta. Whomever does payment on your behalf has to be willing to extend credit for an immediate transaction while the very slow process of exchanging money happens at a delay. This is especially so if the transactions are international. I truly wonder how the phone with just an ordinary bank account does this. Is it Google/Apple who extend credit? If so, is that better?
Most other countries don’t have to rely on the antiquated network the US uses for resolving those bank to bank transactions. In South korea, Street vendors have what looks like a phone number posted on signage around their Wares or snacks and people just make effectively debit pushes from their bank to the merchant’s bank in real time with zero margins.
I kind of expect this is how the rest of the world operates and it’s only the us then sits on using its own infrastructure which it made one time, in the 1960s, and has refused to move off of since. This created a lot of the market need for a bunch of private companies to make their own little piggybacking solutions like venmo, zelle, square cash, and all the others.
Too be fair, a lot of major businesses in the US now just exist as financialization institutions extending debt to their large-scale clientele, under the guise of being manufacturing or data services. Like GM. Or Oracle.
I’d suppose the banks work with each other.
uh…NFC payments work through V/M.
They offer credit to losers to spend more than they should. But the credit rates are what used to be usury when the mob did it.
great news
we need more alternatives to Visa and Mastercard.if Turkey was able to do it with Troy, why not Europe with Wero? Hope it all goes well
Interesting
Efforts are underway to expand the international e-commerce presence of TROY, which is already widely used and 100% accepted at all retail locations and e-commerce platforms across Turkey.
source Translated with translate.kagi.com
Turkish person here: Troy is not yet that popular, but it is slowly getting there. Give it another 5 years. The best example is probably Brazil’s Pix.
Pix is amazing but it is like an instant bank transfer. One cannot buy on credit through Pix.
That’s not exactly true. You can pay through an existing credit card via Pix (it doesn’t have to be Visa or MasterCard), or pay in instalments via pre-approved credit with the bank.
Probably a good thing. Buying on credit is a very bad way to spiral into crushing debt.
Not the same thing. Every european country already has domestic Troy.
Nice. We have JCB in Japan but I think it piggybacks off VISA/Mastercard for overseas transactions. It’d be cool if it partnered up with a European counterpart for purchases made in the EU.
We have JCB as well but only for digging holes and moving earth.
I suppose I could do that too with my JCB, but it would take ages to get anything done since the card isn’t very big or durable!
Great news. In India we have UPI which already made Mastercard and Visa come to their knees.
Just if it worked with international payments.
Currently, International GPay required a credit/debit card and I am unaware of a proper UPI solution for it.
Also, we lack proper FOSS UPI for Linux despite efforts, due to it being dependent on cellular networks.deleted by creator
For Android, we are pretty close.
For Linux, well, as long as I can get a cellular device that works with Linux [1] I am willing to take up development on the Linux branch of the same project. I have actually been considering this for a while and this is the only blocker I see.
could be either a mobile device (smartphone/tablet) or an USB/PCIe WWAN accessory having a Linux compatible cellular chip that also works viably on mobile devices, so I can do the testing. ↩︎
I think the Digital Euro is going to be a better idea long term - taking off the hidden tax of payment processor fees is going to make businesses and people richer.
Don’t you think it has some privacy concerns? And how does it affect small businesses relying on cash? I’m asking genuinely, these are intuitive and not well thought out concerns.
I read that there also are lots of concerns regarding privacy of data. It apparently collects lots of your data and interactions and shares it with third parties for publicity and so. And they’re not transparent at all on this point.
What’s the point of having a European app if it behaves worst than GAFAM?
Anyway, I don’t know how much is rumour, how much is true. Does anybody have more information?
I can’t imagine that they could be worst than the existing VISA and MasterCard duopoly.
If it’s onshore then it would be possible to regulate. If it’s overseas then I imagine it would be harder to regulate without kicking visa and MC out of the EU and then we would need to start over anyway.
Europe’s $24 Trillion
Great, now nobody knows how much that is (other than a lot).
100K is a lot. 24T is unfathomable. :)
It’s transactions at the scale of a continent rather than a household or a business. Hardly unfathomable. Just bigger.
Yeah, but long scale unfathomable, or short scale unfathomable?
Idk count to a trillion and check.
I could make a tally stick worth 24 trillion dollars EZ. Seems pretty fathomable to me.
Isn’t crypto supposed to be a worthless grift tho? \s
Open article, control+f for “crypto”. 0 results.
I wonder how many trillions of dollars the Trump dumpster fire will end up costing American business.
You’d think our corporate overlords would remove him.
I wonder how many trillions of dollars the Trump dumpster fire will end up costing American business.
USAian business does great under fascism. Just look at the MIC. Both “parties” just voted on a massive handout for genocide, etc.
Business will be fine! The right/rich people will be bailed out. Etc.
Only the mega corporations are doing fine. Small businesses are going bust left and right.
Once people lose their jobs and can’t afford to spend, what do you think will happen?
I mean, the proletarinization of the petit bourgeois isn’t exactly something nobody predicted . . .
At this point, I wouldn’t be surprised if they’re working on it. He’s destroying their bottom lines.
That said, if you go after the king, you’d best not miss.
Their bottom lines aren’t very important to their goal of owning everything. Money is just a vehicle for power, but once they own everything and everyone they won’t need it.
The parasites are still making money. Rocking the boat would temporarily interrupt the party, they’ll continue to party until they’re forced to change.
The question is incomplete. They will cost trillions, but the presidency, the party fixing elections right now, will cost the country the dollar itself. They will max out borrowing, then print money to pay off the debt and de facto default. They will turn all of those dollars into very much less valuable things.
Presuming no one stops them.
They will max out borrowing, then print money to pay off the debt and de facto default.
I think you wanted to use past tense here.
Oh they will squeeze tens of trillions more out of the federal government before it fails. Every excuse they will borrow.
The corporate overlords area fucking idiots. They always have been.
True risk is also anathema to them, probably hedging bets on how the midterms go before they make big moves
I think it’s simpler than that and just is down to the impact on the next quarter’s profits.
Most of those overlords don‘t care about their business anymore. They want to get the bag now. It‘s how Oligarchies operate. They burn billions to make millions. Or in this case delete trillions to make billions. The goal is have proportionally much more money than us pathetic peasants.
The way Trump operates in particular is unsurprisingly dull. He flips the table and ruins the game for everyone. Then he waits and whoever says some flattering words to him and gives him a hefty bribe is excluded from his bullshit. Suddenly they see their competition crippled while they themselves can do business as usual. That‘s all there is to it. Trump was never the brightest bulb and probably thinks his obvious scheme is brilliant.
It’s kind of a weird game theory thing, because the industries affected aren’t consistently losing. A decision he makes on Wednesday can help the finance industry but hurt the tech industry, and then he can reverse it on Thursday and now the finance industry is tanking but the insurance industry is up. It’s tough to know who would work together to pull him out of office, because between any two given days, the people who have the money have different opinions on how he’s doing.
24 trillion. the culture war bs with the right is thier best chance of maintain power in the us, so no, they might have accept less to hold on to that power. Or they just stir up the right wing in other countries, alongside with russia.
They’ll make sure it hurts us, long before it ever touches them.
American big business? Not a dime. It’ll be a bailout on the American tax dollar I bet.
I don’t get it, sometimes you wonder if it’s true and he might be acting to help Russia
Sometimes?
Good. The Mastercard and Visa tax never made any sense. We deserve better.
Good. Make it hurt.
I want to see CEOs from the sky.
Yes, make it hurt EU. It sucks that my dumbass country made it come to this, but it needs to happen. Way too many people here pretend the rest of the world doesn’t exist.
They would be tiny from way up there
I like the way you think, get them to terminal velocity.
The most important thing about terminal velocity is the immediate stop and its effects.
And the popcorn stand for spectators. Very important.
I dont
Theyre usually fat old men
Better splats. 🤷
reminds me when Brazil launched their Pix payment system nationwide, which is free for individuals, and the US launched an investigation into unfair trading
potential unfair advantaging of Brazilian payment services over US competitors was cited
Brazilian President Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva has accused US president Donald Trump of being “bothered by Pix” because it “will put an end to credit cards”
lol get rekt
Against what? Against consumers that don’t need to pay fees? Against the Brazilian government who is behind the pix?
Poor US companies with billionaires yatches bills to be paid.
Becoming independent from the US empire‘s dollar or oil is a serious crime that gets punished with dictatorship. It‘s no coincidence the US is launching a cascade of fascist think tanks and lobby groups against Europe right now.
Very well said. What a great ally! My way or the highway.
Hello, friends in civilized lands, especially those of you who work at financial institutions…
Some of us in the states are excited to watch you do some damage to the entrenched middlemen that have been skimming from all of us for so long. Please do consider letting us sign up for the new stuff. Our money is still worth something, for now!
We should solve our own problems. Haven’t we exported enough problems abroad already?
I agree 100% but also this is like when you watch your brother punch your dad to make him stop hitting your mom, and you know you’re going to get the shit kicked out of both of you later for it.
…unless one of your grabs the crowbar and goes for broke…
Hey blue states…
This is like that son that was sexualy abused by his dad for years, then killed and ate him.
This is like that son that was sexualy abused by his dad for years, then killed and ate him.
Seconded.
i would gladly make the switch if for no other reason than just playing a tiny part in screwing over Visa and MasterCard.
Why? Cause fuck em! That’s why!
come on canada start taking notes
Canada has Interac but turned it in a for profit.
The Bank of Canada has considered a digital CAD but not started anything yet. Maybe they are taking notes?
Meanwhile, we could give biz the option to lower their prices and in exchange pass down the cards fees to customers (transparently of course, big display: Visa +n1%, Mastercard: +n2%, …). The current system makes all prices higher but cards provide rebates or other benefits. That’s pretty much a tax on the poor who can’t access “high end” credit cards.
At least we have e transfers and debit unlike down south. I for one will be jumping on the first non us credit card however.
As an American, I just may do the same.
You do realize why we’re scrambling to get a European credit card, right? I mean what’s going to stop us from cutting Americans off when Trump decides to invade San Marino?
Oh I hope that they name it something mildly silly. Like “Lone’y” or “broke buckz”
We have debit. And etransfer for things like PayPal or Venmo.
Ha, venmo is such a scam. And paypal is just as bad as MasterCard
How the fuck is venmo a scam? Jesus Christ what Idiocracy.
How is it not? They take a part of every fucking payment. Jesus Christ would not like it at all.
You mean like every company that charges a fee? That’s not a scam, that’s called business. Jesus Christ it’s like people want everything for free and don’t understand that it costs money to run a business. Credit cards charge interest, your bank charges fees, businesses price stuff over their cost. That farmer you pay for their vegetables charges more then it cost them to produce. These aren’t scams. They are the cost of having services and good provided to you.
How much is the fee? Because last I checked it was not like an etransfer (included in most banking plans).
How does debit work for fraud? Are banks more willing to refund when theres5fraud? In the US it feels like it’s mostly on the user to bear
Depends on your bank, some have insurance on debit (like a credit card) but a lot in Canadian banks are moving to visa/MasterCard debit cards (since a bunch of our banks moved into the us market and are therefore tainted).
How about JCB?
Jbc?
Japan Credit Bureau
Ah, are they world wide and less corrupt?
A lot of countries in Europe already have their own country-wide payment systems.
What we’re seeing now in Europe is the stage where those multiple country-specific systems become interoperable and a new international payment system appears.
Canada only needs the kind of thing which has been not just available but actually dominant for decades in countries like The Netherlands and Portugal.
